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Quote: from Tavis at 11:19 am on April 20, 2008

The funny thing is, is that one CANNOT think back long and hard to the times that they were a child, sure some fleeting memories are still there, but thoughts and desires from that time were not stored, they COULD not be at that stage in development. lets read further and see what else becomes of this.

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I'm sure most people can remember the way their parents treated them. I even used an example, how mine didn't let me watch power rangers.

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You want a 12 month old baby to decide the color of his or her room?
or do you intend to wait until said child is 2-4 when the first words start coming out and then paint it whatever comes out first:
"boat"
"you see that honey, he said boat"
"yep, lets get some boat wall paper!"

thats just silly.

or do you want to wait until the child is 6 and can actually make decisions [albeit they are not informed, they are impuslive] and paint it the neon pink and black and red that the child wants?

children, during their developmental years need to be shaped [and are consequently shaped by EVERYTHING we do, so that our actions reflect who they become, even the smallest of habits]

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Babies are 12 months old. Children are 5-10. And of course you wouldn't make them chose, just if they like a colour, you shouldn't keep it the colour you want.

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You are a moron.
5-6 year olds have no clue about the options available to them, and lecturing them as to the basis and how-to of every sport so that they can make a logical, educated decision is a silly notion.

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Of course it would be. And they will know enough at that age to chose a sport that they want, or none at all, instead of you pushing them to play a certain sport.

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what BETTER decision would the kid make, whose attention span is no longer than a minute?

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Of course, if the kid doesn't like it, I don't think one should MAKE them continue, but the parent should enroll them in ANOTHER sport, let the kid try that out and see what happens.

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That's what I'm stressing. Leaving options open.

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Are you under the impression that pre-teens are rational, logical beings? they are developing and have a limited grasp of the world, and need to be shaped. They are impulsive, and need to be pushed into things so that they can experience them for themselves and make opinions on said matters.

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Yes, they do need to, but once again, leave options open, if they want to dance, so be it, if they want to play any sport, let them, don't push them into a sport they don't like.

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 I do agree with this point, children should be pushed to use their imagination, and develop their own concept of the world around them, and the experiences people face in life. [even if that experience is that of an ambulance "whoosh"ing down the road.]

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I don't quite agree with this, Parents should raise their kids as they see fit. I do not see any harm in showing your son that trucks are more fun than barbies. I see where you are going: "if he's going to be gay he's going to be gay" but I don't think that there is a gay gene, I think that children are raised a certain way, and if their internal conception of normalcy and sexual tendency react a certain way with their nurture, then the result is a homosexual. I do not think that a 4 year old will play with barbies because he likes her shoes, or dress. Its imagination, thats all. So why not simply channel that imagination to something more along the lines of a childhood boy, if thats what the kid is.

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I'm not saying that if he is going to be gay then let him, I'm saying, as said above, let all doors stay open so they aren't pressured into anything to fit in.
 

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I don't know if this is the nature of television and games today that do this [which most kids usually grow out of when they learn the TRUE concepts of right and wrong], or if it something else entirely, but i DO know that what is the MAJOR cause is the lack of parental strictness.

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Well, each to their own, I'm blaming the media and whatnot for how violent they are, but of course it's not 100% anybodies fault.

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All of these liberal hippy parents think that children should be free to express themselves without being "judged". WRONG! kids need discipline so that they can react smoothly with social norms. kids do not know that flailing their arms wildly in public is wrong if you let them do it because "they are expressing themselves", so they wont see anything wrong with doing it in class, or hitting another kid [who the first kid probably doesn't even care about, since he is not aware that the other kid is like him and sees other people].

Kids are not aware of separate minds and individuals, there is themselves, and the other things around them that move. Mommy is the pretty one, daddy is the strong one, billy is the smelly one, mary is the funny one. But I am the only one really here, they are all just "things" to kids, who don't understand sentience of other beings until early pre-teen years.  

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This, I do agree with, because they aren't being strict at all. Sure I'm saying let a kid be who they want to be, but still, teach them morals.

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shouldn't you let your kids decide what they want to watch? you let them decide everything else...Or is it that they can make educated decisions about their sports and recreation, but not their leisure?

though I do agree less video games and more out door encouragement.

you have a misunderstanding as to how well kids understand the world, my friend...

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Sure they can chose what they want to watch, but not when it gets to the point where monkey-see-monkey-do because they saw someone's head get bashed in on a wrestling show that uses highly trained people to do so.

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edit:
also, white walls reflect light, even at night the room would be bright without the windows blacked out. babies tend to wake more often during the night in white rooms due to the excitability of the reflection.

darker colors are much better for babies sleep patterns [even yellows and pinks absorb light and allow the kids to sleep]
what the hell does it matter the color of the room anyway? are you under the impression that your room color made you who you are today? If so, then I maintain that you are a very dull person. If the kid wants to change it later on, sure let him/her change it, but don't leave the wall white because you don't want to infringe upon the 14 year decision making process of your child, come on now.

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Fair enough. I just stress that they should have a neutral room colour, not one for either gender.

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Tav for president

Language Course Support Group

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Babies are 12 months old. Children are 5-10. And of course you wouldn't make them chose, just if they like a colour, you shouldn't keep it the colour you want.

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Of course it would be. And they will know enough at that age to chose a sport that they want, or none at all, instead of you pushing them to play a certain sport.

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I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure that most kids have attention spans that last over a minute.

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 Yes, they do need to, but once again, leave options open, if they want to dance, so be it, if they want to play any sport, let them, don't push them into a sport they don't like.

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I'm not saying that if he is going to be gay then let him, I'm saying, as said above, let all doors stay open so they aren't pressured into anything to fit in.

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Sure they can chose what they want to watch, but not when it gets to the point where monkey-see-monkey-do because they saw someone's head get bashed in on a wrestling show that uses highly trained people to do so

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Fair enough. I just stress that they should have a neutral room colour, not one for either gender.

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As Norock mentioned, without any sort of guide children just float aimlessly in life. Few children, especially young children, are self-motivated. Even those that are, lack the life and practical knowledge of how to get involved in sports, activities and things like that. The job of the parent is to guide the child, it's not to force, but pushing your child into sports and not letting them quit every time they have a bad day is what separates a good parent from a lazy one. I have rarely to never seen a healthy, active, happy product from a household where the parent just shrugged every time the kid wanted to flunk out of something, because they wanted to be supportive in their child's "dislike", like you're encouraging. All they ended up with is a child with self-esteem issues, success fears and a bad habit of quitting.

I'm not sure I would simply accept my son being in no sports. Physical activity is a part of healthy life and a parent that simply neglects that isn't a very good parent in my mind. If they dislike football, fine, as Norock (I think) mentioned, then you try something else. You don't simply say "Oh, fine. Go play video games then since you don't like sports."

The job of the parent is to push the child, shape the child, put the child in some circumstances that force them to grow, not always just their comfort zone.

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Holly.
Mama to Hunter Kai

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Quote: from Tavis at 11:19 am on April 20, 2008

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I have thought about this long and hard, and even had a class of mine discuss this, and I have made a theory how children are raised, and what is to become of their lives, due to their influences.

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this should be interesting

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Lets start with the simplest influence, their parents. Think back long and hard about how your parents raised you. Did they make you do things, or was it an option..? Most parents, I feel, are pushing things upon their children at a younger age, which is transforming them into something they might not want to be.

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The funny thing is, is that one CANNOT think back long and hard to the times that they were a child, sure some fleeting memories are still there, but thoughts and desires from that time were not stored, they COULD not be at that stage in development. lets read further and see what else becomes of this.

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Take the colour of their room for example. You have a son. Most people automatically want that room to be painted blue, to reflect him being a male. This also works with girls and the colour pink, of course. You are assuming that they want this, instead of letting them pick. I think that people should just paint their rooms white, let it be neutral, so the kids can decide once they have that sense of responsibility.

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You want a 12 month old baby to decide the color of his or her room?
or do you intend to wait until said child is 2-4 when the first words start coming out and then paint it whatever comes out first:
"boat"  
"you see that honey, he said boat"
"yep, lets get some boat wall paper!"

thats just silly.

or do you want to wait until the child is 6 and can actually make decisions [albeit they are not informed, they are impuslive] and paint it the neon pink and black and red that the child wants?

children, during their developmental years need to be shaped [and are consequently shaped by EVERYTHING we do, so that our actions reflect who they become, even the smallest of habits]

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The next thing, is what hobbies they are enrolled into. Sure, influencing them to stay active by joining a sport is fine, or playing an instrument, but really, don't choose for them. Although I might be stereotyping a little, most people want their children to play football. However, not all children like it, and only choose that sport to fit in. I suggest leaving all the doors open at all times, to choose what they feel is right. So what if you son or daughter wants to dance, let them. Don't shut doors, or else that might be another career option closed for you son at a younger age.

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You are a moron.
5-6 year olds have no clue about the options available to them, and lecturing them as to the basis and how-to of every sport so that they can make a logical, educated decision is a silly notion.

parents enroll their kids in sports and hobbies that THEY liked as a kid in hopes that the kid will enjoy them too. It also serves as a way for kids to make new friends as well as learn sociability skills and physical fitness.  

what BETTER decision would the kid make, whose attention span is no longer than a minute?

Of course, if the kid doesn't like it, I don't think one should MAKE them continue, but the parent should enroll them in ANOTHER sport, let the kid try that out and see what happens.  

Are you under the impression that pre-teens are rational, logical beings? they are developing and have a limited grasp of the world, and need to be shaped. They are impulsive, and need to be pushed into things so that they can experience them for themselves and make opinions on said matters.

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Now, the main one I want to focus on is the toys they have. Think about how you have turned out. Most of you didn't have a 'ps2' or '360'. Some of you had a sega or another of those older systems, but except for that, there was no talking toys that make their own story. You were allowed to express yourself in any way possible, using your simple, 4-wheeled toy truck, and little work bench where you would make mud pie galore. The barbies with a home, and that was it. You were given choices on what to do, allowed to let your imagination run wild. Now, you have the barbies that talk, and tell you what to do, you have cars, that actually talk, so there is no need for this imagination.

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I do agree with this point, children should be pushed to use their imagination, and develop their own concept of the world around them, and the experiences people face in life. [even if that experience is that of an ambulance "whoosh"ing down the road.]

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Also, don't choose who you want your child to be. If he wants to play with barbies, so be it. If she wants to play with trucks, so be it. Let them choose what they want to play with, who they want to play with, what they want to play! I'm not sure, but maybe people will be a lot more accepting in the newest generation, if they are allowed to do what they want.

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I don't quite agree with this, Parents should raise their kids as they see fit. I do not see any harm in showing your son that trucks are more fun than barbies. I see where you are going: "if he's going to be gay he's going to be gay" but I don't think that there is a gay gene, I think that children are raised a certain way, and if their internal conception of normalcy and sexual tendency react a certain way with their nurture, then the result is a homosexual. I do not think that a 4 year old will play with barbies because he likes her shoes, or dress. Its imagination, thats all. So why not simply channel that imagination to something more along the lines of a childhood boy, if thats what the kid is.

[again, sure if the kid cries about it and wants the barbie back, give it to him, but if he is just as content with the trucks, or the gi joes, whats the harm?]

 

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Finally, I'd also like to point out how violent kids are in the newest generation, the ones going into grade 1 now. I have a little friend who is in grade two, but he is very violent. He tries to beat me up, and always is angry. As are two little girls I know. One rips my hair while the other chokes me. Think of what is happening to our next generation. They are being influnced way to much with violence.

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I don't know if this is the nature of television and games today that do this [which most kids usually grow out of when they learn the TRUE concepts of right and wrong], or if it something else entirely, but i DO know that what is the MAJOR cause is the lack of parental strictness.  

All of these liberal hippy parents think that children should be free to express themselves without being "judged". WRONG! kids need discipline so that they can react smoothly with social norms. kids do not know that flailing their arms wildly in public is wrong if you let them do it because "they are expressing themselves", so they wont see anything wrong with doing it in class, or hitting another kid [who the first kid probably doesn't even care about, since he is not aware that the other kid is like him and sees other people].

Kids are not aware of separate minds and individuals, there is themselves, and the other things around them that move. Mommy is the pretty one, daddy is the strong one, billy is the smelly one, mary is the funny one. But I am the only one really here, they are all just "things" to kids, who don't understand sentience of other beings until early pre-teen years.  

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The WWE for example. Parents seem more and more lenient to them watching these kinds of things. My parents didn't even allow me to watch Power Rangers, because it was violent, and they don't want violence at a younger age. Also, the video games they play. My older brother, SilverDoor, works at an 'Electronic Boutique Games (EB Games)', and parents don't even care the littlest that they are buying their 7 year old a game where there is swearing, violence, guns, drugs. The key game is Grand theft auto, but there is so many out there, that keep influencing the way children act.

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shouldn't you let your kids decide what they want to watch? you let them decide everything else...Or is it that they can make educated decisions about their sports and recreation, but not their leisure?  

though I do agree less video games and more out door encouragement.  

you have a misunderstanding as to how well kids understand the world, my friend...

edit:
also, white walls reflect light, even at night the room would be bright without the windows blacked out. babies tend to wake more often during the night in white rooms due to the excitability of the reflection.

darker colors are much better for babies sleep patterns [even yellows and pinks absorb light and allow the kids to sleep]
what the hell does it matter the color of the room anyway? are you under the impression that your room color made you who you are today? If so, then I maintain that you are a very dull person. If the kid wants to change it later on, sure let him/her change it, but don't leave the wall white because you don't want to infringe upon the 14 year decision making process of your child, come on now.

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Well I was about to post this, but norok beat me to it.

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7ft tall he was, with eyes as black as sin, some say he had
tree trunks for legs - JC

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I have to say I agree with Norock. Your idea is sweet in theory Tavis, that children should be respected and allowed to make as many decisions as possible. But as someone with a small child, I can tell you that it's just not practical.

As Norock mentioned, without any sort of guide children just float aimlessly in life. Few children, especially young children, are self-motivated. Even those that are, lack the life and practical knowledge of how to get involved in sports, activities and things like that. The job of the parent is to guide the child, it's not to force, but pushing your child into sports and not letting them quit every time they have a bad day is what separates a good parent from a lazy one. I have rarely to never seen a healthy, active, happy product from a household where the parent just shrugged every time the kid wanted to flunk out of something, because they wanted to be supportive in their child's "dislike", like you're encouraging. All they ended up with is a child with self-esteem issues, success fears and a bad habit of quitting.  

I'm not sure I would simply accept my son being in no sports. Physical activity is a part of healthy life and a parent that simply neglects that isn't a very good parent in my mind. If they dislike football, fine, as Norock (I think) mentioned, then you try something else. You don't simply say "Oh, fine. Go play video games then since you don't like sports."  

The job of the parent is to push the child, shape the child, put the child in some circumstances that force them to grow, not always just their comfort zone.

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I agree with this exactly. You simply cannot expect a child to make informed decisions about what they want to do. If they don't like Sport "A", fine, but that doesn't mean that you should just let them not do anything. Get them to try out other activities, otherwise they'll never get the chance to know what they like and dislike.

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.:.Faut souffrir pour etre belle.:.
♥ hey there, delilah, what's it like in new york city?