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Quote: from norock at 11:37 am on Mar. 26, 2008

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Quote: from merlinman2005 at 7:33 pm on Mar. 25, 2008

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Quote: from jumbo55 at 6:30 pm on Mar. 25, 2008

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they wouldnt do something like that...

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  Wrong.  
  They would.    
  And they have.  

  Come on, man.

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 You are a fucking idiot lol  
 not all knowledge is begot in school, and you should not make your knowledge begotten on "Teh Internetz".  

 fool

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fuck the internet
i read BOOKS published by archaeologists and research done by those who know their shit

thanks for assuming, though.

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Yea? lets hear of some.
I would like a few papers/works/publishings/books of different archaeologists who claim that there was a previous human civilization. note, I do not mean those that lived during the younger dryas or the primitive homo-erectus folk.

I mean a legitimate human civilization that got wiped out and left almost NO evidence.

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...

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Quote: from merlinman2005 at 12:42 pm on Mar. 26, 2008

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Quote: from norock at 11:37 am on Mar. 26, 2008

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Quote: from merlinman2005 at 7:33 pm on Mar. 25, 2008

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Quote: from jumbo55 at 6:30 pm on Mar. 25, 2008

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they wouldnt do something like that...

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  Wrong.  
  They would.
  And they have.  

  Come on, man.

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  You are a fucking idiot lol
  not all knowledge is begot in school, and you should not make your knowledge begotten on "Teh Internetz".

  fool

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 fuck the internet  
 i read BOOKS published by archaeologists and research done by those who know their shit  

 thanks for assuming, though.

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Yea? lets hear of some.
I would like a few papers/works/publishings/books of different archaeologists who claim that there was a previous human civilization. note, I do not mean those that lived during the younger dryas or the primitive homo-erectus folk.  

I mean a legitimate human civilization that got wiped out and left almost NO evidence.

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The civilization didn't necasarily have to be human. Instead of making other people look for you, how about showing some intellectual curiosity and finding them yourself?

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We all must face our Moment of Truth.

This person is making a claim that there has been a previous human civilization on Earth.

I do not know if you are acquainted with proper argumentative etiquette, but the person who is making claims [outrageous or not] is the one responsible for providing the evidence; the burden is on them.

also, it was offered in his last post, so i am merely taking him up on it.

Regardless of what the civilization was there would be EVIDENCE.

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...

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Ha!

This person is making a claim that there has been a previous human civilization on Earth.

I do not know if you are acquainted with proper argumentative etiquette, but the person who is making claims [outrageous or not] is the one responsible for providing the evidence; the burden is on them.

also, it was offered in his last post, so i am merely taking him up on it.  

Regardless of what the civilization was there would be EVIDENCE.

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Say if the civilization was in the state of human activity we know to have happened like 40,000 years ago, and most were nomad travelers searching for their next meal ->> there would be less than 10,000 humans. Assuming that they're inveretbrates which have a better chance han non-invertbrates of leaving traces behind, it is still VERY rare to get fossilized reamins in sediment. Maybe the sea level was lower then and they lived only on the coast? But, if they were invertebrates which I think is possible to evolve highly intelligent as well then we may never find them.

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Oinkness: I didn't start learning scales until
after I had written 2 full-length albums.

those individuals would still be part of THIS civilization.
EVOLUTION people.

for it to be a separate human civilization, the ENTIRE race would have to be destroyed and develop again.

we would have to RE-EVOLVE from the beginning which is QUITE unlikely to say the least.

are you making the claim that there could be a civilization of human invertebrates, or that a collection of invertebrates created a civilization?

Either one is completely silly to think of anyway.
1) The idea is for "human" civilizations
2) humans CAN NOT BE INVERTEBRATES, are you kidding? gravity would crush us into blobs had we not had bone structures.

the main point is that the idea is for "human" civilization before the beginnings of our evolution of humanity.
I mean hell, sure, the homo-erectus people of the younger dryas might be considered a prior civilization, but they are one that led up to us.

the ONLY way for there to have been a prior civilization is if humans evolved, then died off COMPLETELY, then RE-evolved.
as i said before,
NO, there was not a previous human civilization.

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...

Now, I can't prove that this organism would have to fit under the scientific definition of "human": erect carriage, spoken language, etc, but it would be very close in intelligence, language, and so on. Tat is also what I'm saying, it would have been wiped out in an extinction and we would "have to start over", but millions of years of course that is possible. How long did it take the common ape ancestor to become human??? ->> scientists believe 3-5 million years...if this civilization arose before the dinosaurs it's possible that there have been numerous civilizations similar to ours, maybe like in the human stone age, but they died out. It's not entirely implausible -->>we'd have to be arrogant to think our "human race" will lost that long with nature doing its' "work".

" NO, there was not a previous human civilization.
" I'm totally neutral in belief, so you prove it.

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Oinkness: I didn't start learning scales until
after I had written 2 full-length albums.

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Ok, first I will say something about the less important thing ->> invertebrates COULD evolve into something highly intelligent and the Octopus is widely considered the most intelligent invertebrate on earth and it can grow to over 40 feet in the ocean -->> you're just thinking about land.  

Now, I can't prove that this organism would have to fit under the scientific definition of "human": erect carriage, spoken language, etc, but it would be very close in intelligence, language, and so on. Tat is also what I'm saying, it would have been wiped out in an extinction and we would "have to start over", but millions of years of course that is possible. How long did it take the common ape ancestor to become human??? ->> scientists believe 3-5 million years...if this civilization arose before the dinosaurs it's possible that there have been numerous civilizations similar to ours, maybe like in the human stone age, but they died out. It's not entirely implausible -->>we'd have to be arrogant to think our "human race" will lost that long with nature doing its' "work".

" NO, there was not a previous human civilization.
" I'm totally neutral in belief, so you prove it.

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1) NOTICE, that i did not say that invertebrates could not become intelligent. however, I DID say that they could not develop ON LAND, nor could they create any type of civilization without a base in nature [ie. a civilization in which they adapt nature to their needs not vice versa].

2) I don't care how you twist it lol you can NOT have an invertebrate human. the homo-sapien, homo-erectus species is not some classification given to a species that is smart. It is the name given to those two respective species.

The question was posed:

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Is it possible that there was a previous "human" civilization on earth

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If you meant human, then NO, it is not.
If you meant otherwise then you must define what you mean by civilization.
A civilization has to be more than having homes and helping out in a community, as ALL animals do that.

We have jobs that suit us, ants have jobs that suit them in their colonies, all of nature is set up so that a species can protect itself and survive.

So what then, do you define as a civilization?

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...

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Quote: from Leichenschrei at 4:00 pm on Mar. 26, 2008

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Ok, first I will say something about the less important thing ->> invertebrates COULD evolve into something highly intelligent and the Octopus is widely considered the most intelligent invertebrate on earth and it can grow to over 40 feet in the ocean -->> you're just thinking about land.  

 Now, I can't prove that this organism would have to fit under the scientific definition of "human": erect carriage, spoken language, etc, but it would be very close in intelligence, language, and so on. Tat is also what I'm saying, it would have been wiped out in an extinction and we would "have to start over", but millions of years of course that is possible. How long did it take the common ape ancestor to become human??? ->> scientists believe 3-5 million years...if this civilization arose before the dinosaurs it's possible that there have been numerous civilizations similar to ours, maybe like in the human stone age, but they died out. It's not entirely implausible -->>we'd have to be arrogant to think our "human race" will lost that long with nature doing its' "work".  

 " NO, there was not a previous human civilization.  
 " I'm totally neutral in belief, so you prove it.

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1) NOTICE, that i did not say that invertebrates could not become intelligent.

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however, I DID say that they could not develop ON LAND, nor could they create any type of civilization without a base in nature [ie. a civilization in which they adapt nature to their needs not vice versa].  

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2) I don't care how you twist it lol you can NOT have an invertebrate human. the homo-sapien, homo-erectus species is not some classification given to a species that is smart. It is the name given to those two respective species.

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The question was posed:

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Is it possible that there was a previous "human" civilization on earth

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If you meant human, then NO, it is not.
If you meant otherwise then you must define what you mean by civilization.  
A civilization has to be more than having homes and helping out in a community, as ALL animals do that.  

We have jobs that suit us, ants have jobs that suit them in their colonies, all of nature is set up so that a species can protect itself and survive.  

So what then, do you define as a civilization?

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Another wrong definition on my part, sorry, and I mean civilization to be a basic community characterized by some of the arts like painting and singing and higher tasks like tool making, building fire, etc.

You understand what I mean now, but I'll rephrase my question best I can,

Is it possible that there was a previous community of organisms that were capable of thought and action of higher mental facualty and did similar things that humans do (ie: art)?

Basically asking did they have a mind similar to us. \

Thanks,

Leichen

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Oinkness: I didn't start learning scales until
after I had written 2 full-length albums.

Most likely, we developed our intelligence out of need for ingenuity so that we could outwit the other species that were battling for top-of-the-food-chain. Then, when we were on top, and the challenges we faced were less, we were able to develop mentally --instead of physically.

Unless that species was atop its food chain, and had the means to be intelligent --and also the necessity-- sure, it could be possible.

Is it likely, though, that another species had the necessity to be intelligent, and therefore developed its cognitive abilities to a point similar to ours [wherein art and entertainment are forms of expression].
..I don't think so, personally.

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...

We haven't found a shred of evidence for either. As for non-human, there is nothing in the fossil record that suggests a line of organisms once existed or still exists other than humans that had the capacity to build such a civilisation.

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Massive, epic adventure, multi-coloured, multi-layered.
Sort of two/three dimensional Wizard of Oz for the future.

As for the Nazca Lines, they aren't exactly revolutionary. Get a few workesr with wooden stakes and string and you can make anything you like. Why make it so it can only be seen from the air? They were religious, religious people occasionally do weird things. If hi-tech aliens did make them then they sure did love wood and ceramics as much as the next cave man.

And if the Library of Alexandria contained records of untold magic and technology it seems strange that the aliens don't get a mention and stranger still that the aliens gave the books and scrolls to a third party who then passed it on to the library.

A hugely easier explanation for these mysterys is that there is no mystery.

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Massive, epic adventure, multi-coloured, multi-layered.
Sort of two/three dimensional Wizard of Oz for the future.

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It's painfully obvious to any cretin that the Atlantis story is a myth invented as a nice analogy.

As for the Nazca Lines, they aren't exactly revolutionary. Get a few workesr with wooden stakes and string and you can make anything you like. Why make it so it can only be seen from the air? They were religious, religious people occasionally do weird things. If hi-tech aliens did make them then they sure did love wood and ceramics as much as the next cave man.

And if the Library of Alexandria contained records of untold magic and technology it seems strange that the aliens don't get a mention and stranger still that the aliens gave the books and scrolls to a third party who then passed it on to the library.

A hugely easier explanation for these mysterys is that there is no mystery.

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QFT

conspiracies sound great to the inspired, but when investigated... the arguments are usually paper thin.

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            ...life is good...
...mai ho oni i ka wai lana malie...